EX5 non-responsive buttons / SD card reader SCSI issue

The EX5 features a unique Extended Synthesis system which incorporates a number of advanced tone generator technologies. AWM2, AN, FDSP and VL. The EX5 is one of the best keyboard Yamaha ever produced.

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waystein
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EX5 non-responsive buttons / SD card reader SCSI issue

Unread post by waystein »

I have owned and played my EX5 since 2003.
I just did battery change, and now none of the buttons on the Board respond. It Plays, and mod Wheel and Pitch Works, but none of the buttons work, not VOICE/PERFORMANCE/EDIT/DISK, and the 1,2,3,4,5 etc voice Select work briefly, then stop. That is, I can change the Voice (sound) once or twice within 3 Seconds of booting up, but thereafter all buttons stop responding.

I did not disconnect anything, just gently replaced the battery with that bottom cover plate off.

I recall this happening once way back, and I am sure there is dialog about it on EX5tech. I remember being panicked about the Board being dead, then resurrected after advice from others on ex5tech online forum.
I kept notes of all this stuff but on a long dead computer.
My first thought was to check the SCSI termination - since I have a PCD47B SCSI SD card Reader in Place of the floppy. Booting with SCSI termination on or off makes no difference, though. There may be some jumpers on the card reader, too, that I haven't looked at yet.
HOWEVER disconnecting the SCSI inside solves the problem with the buttons. I just need to get the PCD47B SD card reader set up again.
My trusty EX5 has worked with the card reader installation for all these years. It worked fine right before the battery change.
Derek has helped point me to his ex5tech.co.uk, but I haven't found anything among the wayback backups available, though I am sure the solution was posted and discussed on ex5tech.
Any advice?


Stein
Yamaha EX5, DX21, 01v96 dig mixer, PA speakers.
Nord Stage2, Novation Mininova, Alesis QS8, Rhodes stage mkII.
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Re: EX5 non-responsive buttons / SD card reader SCSI issue

Unread post by Derek »

Sadly I cannot offer any advice on why a battery change could have caused an issue, unless something was disturbed whilst you had the EX5 upside down. So I would check all cables to ensure they are firmly seated, also pulling them out and putting them back one at a time just in case there are any oxidised/tarnished connectors giving a poor connection.

Most problems I have ever had with synths are connector based!

Sticky buttons are more problematic and may require an overhaul. I have noticed my EX5R has some sticky buttons, so I might replace them. I did that to my TG77 last year and the difference makes it well worth the effort. Of course it is easier on a rack than a keyboard. I am still plucking up the courage to do All the switches on my SY99!


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Re: EX5 non-responsive buttons / SD card reader SCSI issue

Unread post by jima »

Hi Waystein,

There is no reason at all why disconnecting the SCSI cable should have any effect on the buttons other than physical cable dislodgement. Correct termination is always desirable but in my experience the short cables in the EX plus the limited number of devices (board, ASIB1 and drive) don't normally cause an issue with a decent drive, I have a PCD-47B in my EX5 and it is rock solid with or without termination (I always do though from old habits). A few thoughts, first run the diagnostics (disconnect all SCSI if you need to but it shouldn't be necessary). Check the voltage it reports for the battery - quality varies greatly depending on make - don't cheapskate here. Lastly, do a factory reset (back up first). After that, carefully check that you aren't getting any SCSI device ID conflicts. Not sure what to suggest after that but do let us know how you get on.


Jim
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Re: EX5 non-responsive buttons / SD card reader SCSI issue

Unread post by Derek »

Good points, Jim, especially the one about SCSI device conflicts. I hadn’t thought about that one, but if the EX5 SCSI device was not the default and the battery reset has changed it to conflict...


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Derek Cook

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waystein
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Re: EX5 non-responsive buttons / SD card reader SCSI issue

Unread post by waystein »

Thank you for your input, gentlemen!
I am especially interested in the fact that you, Jim also have the PCD47B installed.
See, I remember distinctly something about a two step installation process, where I had to start with a certain SCSI ID# setting and jumper/termination setting, turn on the EX5 once, then change some setting (SCSI ID#???) before turning the unit off, then changing the termination and/or jumper configuration, and turning the EX5 on a second time, in order to set up the card reader correctly.

I just can't remember the details (it was about 15 years ago), but I do vaguely recall having the same unresponsive button issue when not doing it the right way.

The battery change, of course resulted in a full reset of the EX5, and I have done another reset myself since then.
I did all kinds of backup onto the SD card before battery change, so I am not afraid of experimenting.
But, as I stated before, after disconnecting the SCSI cable, the buttons and everything else works perfectly, other than the user banks being empty, so this is not a button issue. It is a conflict, as you suggest, Jim, and really just a matter of getting the SCSI card reader set up correctly again.

So, Jim ( or anyone else) do you have any kept notes or info on how to install the PCD47B?
Are you willing to check what your SCSI software settings and hardware jumper settings on the PCD47B are?
:o :o :o :o :o :o :o :o :o
Oh wait!!! Stop the press - I just found something on the EX5tech.co.uk Wayback Archive:
https://web.archive.org/web/20160312202 ... =get_topic
See if that rings a bell, Jim - member "EX5tech" describes unresponsive buttons near the bottom of the page - gotta go back and fine read that page once more.... EXciting!!
UPDATE:
As you suggested, Derek, the SCSI ID must have gotten messed up, however, according to the EX5 manual, SCSI ID will not even show up as an option in UTILITY without the ASIB1 connected - and I have to disconnect it to use the Utility button - catch 22...

Here is my theory, now: Battery change/reset change my EX5 SCSI ID back to factory default ID2. It needs to be ID# 0 in order to not conflict with the three IDs selected for the 47B. However, I have to have the ASIB1 SCSI adapter CONNECTED, or SCSI ID will not show up in the Utility menu at all. But the 47B needs to be DISCONNECTED from the ASIB1, or I won't be able to push the Utility button, since no buttons work. That cable is harder to get to, so I can't do this immediately. EXciting!!! I am onto something!!


Stein
Yamaha EX5, DX21, 01v96 dig mixer, PA speakers.
Nord Stage2, Novation Mininova, Alesis QS8, Rhodes stage mkII.
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Re: EX5 non-responsive buttons / SD card reader SCSI issue

Unread post by jima »

Hi,

Try these :) The EX5 is on SCSI ID 02 (really). MO0 is CF in a PCMCIA adapter, MO1 is Smartmedia, MO2 is CF, all on line in the EX!
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.


Jim
Yamaha EX5, AN1X, TG500, Moog Werkstatt, Korg Wavestation SR, Sigma, Legacy Digital, Nord Modular G2, G2 Engine, Focusrite PRO 40, MIDISPORT 8x8/s, Uno, Arturia Keylab 49 MkII, BeatStep, V Collection, Pigments | Love keyboards but so little time :(
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Re: EX5 non-responsive buttons / SD card reader SCSI issue

Unread post by waystein »

Thanks a million for those pictures! Jedi level support, indeed!

That DOES seem like a smarter setup, since hard reset / battery replacement won't mess you up, having EX5 SCSI ID set to the default "2" value.
Is your ASIB1 terminator switch on or off?

What I did so far: Disconnected the SCSI cable from the ASIB1 to the PCD47B. Powered on the EX5. Changed Utility-Other -SCSI ID from 2 to 0.
Powered off. Re-connected the PCD47B. Powered on again. Disappointment - still locked up buttons.

i am now going to pull out the PCD47B and try your settings on it.


Stein
Yamaha EX5, DX21, 01v96 dig mixer, PA speakers.
Nord Stage2, Novation Mininova, Alesis QS8, Rhodes stage mkII.
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waystein
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Re: EX5 non-responsive buttons / SD card reader SCSI issue

Unread post by waystein »

UPDATE / ISSUE RESOLVED!!
I changed the SCSI ID to 3 and powered off. Connected the PCD47B and then powered on again.
The SCSI ID has gotten changed to 7 automatically.
The PCD47B now works, and all buttons respond.
I just restored the ALL DATA backup, and all is well.

I am still not sure what my PCD47B jumper settings are.
You see, my cordless screwdriver died, so I decided to try another EX5 SCSI ID setting, rather than wait until tomorrow, since I didn't want use a manual screwdriver on all those bottom plate screws.
Now my EX5 is fully restored and functioning. YES!! Thank you so much Jim and Derek for helping out and for saving at least some of the ex5tech content!!

So to anyone else experiencing unresponsive buttons in an EX5 with ASIB1 SCSI output adapter and some kind of other than floppydisk memory device installed:
Power off and turn upside down on a soft surface.
Open up the smaller bottom panel. See if there is a second SCSI cable connected to the hard-to-reach end of the SCSI unit. If there is: Remove the two screws on the ASIB1 SCSI card. Pull it halfway out (inwards) and remove the hard-to-reach SCSI cable. Put the ASIB1 SCSI unit back in place and fasten one of the screws, or in some other way protect it so it doesn't touch anything inside the EX5 when flipping it over. Power on . UTILITY -Other -SCSI ID: change it to 0 - or perhaps 3 - 0r 7. Power off. Flip over. Connect the SCSI cable again. Repeat until it works.
(To see if it works: The buttons work again, and you can access the SD card: push DISK - LOAD - and when FDO does not work, use up arrow, wheel, and Enter to change it to MO0, MO1 or MO2 - depending what memory card is in place.)
Last edited by waystein on Mon Aug 17, 2020 8:02 am, edited 1 time in total.


Stein
Yamaha EX5, DX21, 01v96 dig mixer, PA speakers.
Nord Stage2, Novation Mininova, Alesis QS8, Rhodes stage mkII.
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Re: EX5 non-responsive buttons / SD card reader SCSI issue

Unread post by parametric »

It's always GOOD to hear that the help available in THIS Forum has been successful! ((i))

As you remarked - it helps other who find themselves in similar situations . . .

. . . So THANKS for posting back and letting us know (Y)

How I loved - and remember SCSI :lol:

A revelation back in the day to attach so many drives . . . .

I also remember the "Black-Art" of terminating (or not terminating) the SCSI Chain . . . . :o

Some naughty devices needed to be the end device, or they wouldn't work as expected . . . . :?

The Akai S1000 - IIRC . . . . .

SO MUCH fun . . . . :lol:


parametric


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Re: EX5 non-responsive buttons / SD card reader SCSI issue

Unread post by Derek »

Hi, Stein

I'm glad you have it working, I think the info that Jim gave you got you on the right track, which is good.


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Derek Cook

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Re: EX5 non-responsive buttons / SD card reader SCSI issue

Unread post by waystein »

Shit. Played something as rare these days as an outdoor wedding gig yesterday with the ex5 as second keyboard and twice it froze with a stuck note and unresponsive in the middle of a song. Hade to quickly fade out and reboot the EX5 while still playing my Nord.
What the heck could that be? Works fine for up to 30 minutes, then wham!


Stein
Yamaha EX5, DX21, 01v96 dig mixer, PA speakers.
Nord Stage2, Novation Mininova, Alesis QS8, Rhodes stage mkII.
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Re: EX5 non-responsive buttons / SD card reader SCSI issue

Unread post by waystein »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nzJIGBB ... p=desktop
Disconnected the SCSI card and all seemed fine after that. Let it sit for a few hours and came back to this - digital epilepsy?
Rebooted and all pitches were 5 octaves and 8 semitones too high. Got that back to normal, but for how long?


Stein
Yamaha EX5, DX21, 01v96 dig mixer, PA speakers.
Nord Stage2, Novation Mininova, Alesis QS8, Rhodes stage mkII.
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